This discussion explores the future of intelligence, consciousness, and morality with developmental biologist Michael Levin. He challenges the idea that our current embodiment is optimal, arguing for a future where intelligence expands beyond human constraints. Levin discusses collective intelligence, cognition at all levels (from molecules to AI), and the potential for future entities to possess greater compassion. The conversation questions whether intelligence inevitably leads to empathy or if new forms of intelligence might prioritize other goals.